Discussion about this post

User's avatar
Dukeboy01's avatar

Rod spends the first 2/3 of today's missive demanding more gate keeping of ideas that he doesn't agree with and explicitly accepting the position that not just Fuentes should be shunned but that Tucker Carlson should also be written out of polite society for the crime of attempting dialogue with him and not attacking him in the manner that Rod would have preferred.

He then spends extra time making an emotional appeal to authority that the groypers explicitly reject. They don't care about Auschwitz. They believe that at the minimum it's exaggerated and at the worst, it's entirely made up. At any rate it is in the ancient past as far as they're concerned and irrelevant to their concerns today. Invoking the Holocaust makes Boomers and most GenXers misty. No one under 30 cares.

Rod then devotes the rest of the diary to David Brooks and his general cluelessness about the world. He includes this:

"OK, but still, white people, especially white Christians, and white Christian males most of all, are the only ones in America who were not allowed to identify with a group, and group interests. Consequently, they became demonized, and really did lose job opportunities, educational opportunities, and so forth. What interest do they have in maintaining an order that systematically demonized them? I cannot make it clearer how much I loathe Nick Fuentes … but he came from somewhere."

Well, one place Fuentes came from is the fact that Buckleyite Conservatives and their Neocon allies purged older, wiser, more rational voices who addressed much of the groypers' grievances for wrong- think on Israel, immigration, and racial matters back in the 1990s and early 2000s. Sam Francis, Steve Sailor, John Derbyshire, Peter Brimelow and, of course, Patrick Buchanan himself all got declared personas non gratis for challenging the progressive position on these issues a little too aggressively and forth- rightly.

So, for the last 20 years or so, the perception of mainstream conservative thought has centered around "What's good for Israel/ the Military Industrial Complex/ Corporate Financial Interests?" and "The Conservative Case for Whatever Perversion Progressives Want to Push on Us."

The groypers are rejecting much of that and, being kids, they're doing it (or overdoing it) in offensively stupid ways. But they're not wrong to dismiss much of what has passed for mainstream conservative thought for the last 30 years, which is to say, for their entire lives.

And what does Rod offer the groypers to address their concerns in the temporal world they live in? Appeals to religious sensibilities don't work in a post- Christian world. Each individual groyper might be brought to a personal relationship with Christ that would (hopefully) but that still doesn't address their temporal concerns.

The really crazy thing is that, except for The Jew Thing, Rod points out routinely much of their concerns. He bangs on constantly about The Great Replacement ongoing in Europe. He routinely reports tales of Christian men being abandoned and divorced by their wives for no reason at all. He mentions black dysfunction all the time.

Were it not for the groypers' obsession with The Jew Thing as opposed to focusing on the atrocious behavior of the secular Israeli government, as Tucker tried to suggest that they do, Rod shares many of their same concerns. Their problems are real. Refusing to engage with them just sends the message that you don't care. You dismiss them and they'll dismiss you. The problem is that they're gonna be here at lot longer than Rod or I will.

Expand full comment
Jerry's avatar

I think A.J. Hamilton is reading stuff that wasn't there into the statement of Kevin Roberts.

As I heard it, Kevin makes two points that are very much along the lines of my own in a couple comments here this week when I said:

>>Personally, I don't get why it's so hard to understand the entirely legitimate and non-extreme position that the interests of America do not always exactly correspond to the interests of Israel...that no nation should be given a blank check by the United States...that the welfare of the American people should take priority over the welfare of the Israeli people or the Ukrainian people or the people of any other country on the globe.

This is my view and I believe it's an entirely legitimate expression of patriotism, realism, nationalism...and sanity. As opposed to the non-legitimate and extremist position that Jews are bad, that Jews run the country, that Jews are organized into a sinister cabal, that Jews are threats, blah blah blah -- all of which is classic anti-Semitism with a long historical pedigree. It is frankly a virus of the mind.

So to me, unthinking support for Israel and falsely labeling as antisemitic those opposing such a stance constitute one extreme. Hate-mongering and conspiracy theories about Jews are the actually antisemitic opposite extreme. The rational, defensible, and patriotic middle ground strikes me as the one I outlined above.<<

And:

>>...the much more dangerous and immediate threat is from the Wokeist ideology of the Dem-Media Party and its allies controlling major institutions of our society. Therefore, engaging in ritual denunciations of people on what is loosely called the "Right" is a counterproductive distraction from the real war.

If some other conservatives don't share that view...if they think some people on the Right to include a bunch of snarky nobodies in a group chat...are a problem on par with the forces responsible for the murder of Charlie Kirk, then, OK, it's a free country and they're allowed to hold that view. But they should not impute bad faith to conservatives who disagree with their judgment on that question.<<

Meanwhile, it seems clear to me that the current game of Nick Fuentes and his ilk is to gain respectability by hijacking the mantle of "America First."

But you don't have to be antisemitic, as Fuentes is, to subscribe to America First. In fact, the guy who basically founded the America First movement, fellow by the name of Trump, is not antisemitic and has actually provided Israel with crucial support over the last several turbulent months. (Arguably too much support but that's a different question.)

However you cut it, this ugly and apparently widening rift within the world of conservatism is a huge gift to the real enemy, which is why I think conservatives should not play the game...should not get trapped in this no-win quicksand.

Expand full comment
489 more comments...

No posts